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Topic: «[ANN] Beta 5 is delayed until next Monday » on forum: Beta Testing   Views: 50936
 
Susan
Registered user
 
 Posts: 22
Joined: 10/21/2013
Posted: 08/22/2014 07:43:01
 
 
 I totally agree with Gerard. There is absolutely NO REASON to apologise!!

When you run beta code, you should expect issues. That's kind of the point. Don't want issues, don't run the code. Simple.

Running beta code is a personal choice, no-one forces you to do it. I do it because I like to play with sparkly new toys and gadgets. New whizzy toys, especially computer-related, make me happy. When it all goes wrong I take it in good grace - It was my choice, and I always have a fall-back position.

Yes it was fun trying to remove the old beta, but I had forgotten that stuff is dumped all over the place these days. That was my fault - I should get more sleep. :)

Anyway Alex, thanks for taking the time to apologise. That was really gracious of you, but please don't feel bad: You are doing a truly awesome job! All of you!!! 8)

Much love and best wishes,
Susi xxx
 
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Rick Workman
Registered user
 
 Posts: 11
Joined: 02/11/2013
Posted: 08/22/2014 15:09:10
 
 
 First of all, I totally agree on everything Susan said. Tech Support is awesome. Think about other software, that you may have, where Support is basically nonexistent, with or without user forums.

I may have been lucky or what ever, I reinstalled the version 8.1.4 when mine expired as well. The 8.1.4 installed fine without any other changes or modifications. I haven't seen any issues in downgrading. I came out to get the latest beta, and decided to read this post again.

I never let software upgrade it self. Why, I like to download the programs myself. The names get changed to include the version numbers and saved in a file structure to easily find them again. If I have issues, I already have the downloaded programs to be reinstalled. Not all companies keep older versions of their programs, available to be downloaded, if a user needs to go backwards. Depends on the company and/or product on how long I keep older versions. In some cases, older versions may be burnt to CD's or DVD's before being deleted.

I'm not going to mention the software, but XYZ company released a new version and stripped out a very popular feature, stating that they didn't think anyone really used it. Yes, that is their claim. A whole lot of users demanded refunds, just because of this. Fortunately, I didn't even attempt to upgrade. Because of the lack of that one feature, I may start looking at alternatives. Personally, I feel they lost an experienced programmer and no one else knew the code. Fortunately for their users, the older versions were still available.

Basically, I just wanted to share my experiences with downgrading to 8.1.4.

Later,
 
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Gerard Booth
Advanced user
 
 Posts: 119
Joined: 08/04/2008
Posted: 08/22/2014 15:57:40
 
 
 Well said Susan, You phrased that far better than me.

Quote
When you run beta code, you should expect issues. That's kind of the point. Don't want issues, don't run the code. Simple.

Running beta code is a personal choice, no-one forces you to do it. I do it because I like to play with sparkly new toys and gadgets. New whizzy toys, especially computer-related, make me happy. When it all goes wrong I take it in good grace - It was my choice, and I always have a fall-back position.

Excellent advice from Rick, I have essentially the same system, all installation packages, registration/purchase data (including previous versions, renamed with version info) are stored in a folder structure on a NAS Device which is backed up on a regular basis.

Quote
I never let software upgrade it self. Why, I like to download the programs myself. The names get changed to include the version numbers and saved in a file structure to easily find them again. If I have issues, I already have the downloaded programs to be reinstalled. Not all companies keep older versions of their programs, available to be downloaded, if a user needs to go backwards. Depends on the company and/or product on how long I keep older versions. In some cases, older versions may be burnt to CD's or DVD's before being deleted.
 
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Xahi4475
Registered user
 
 Posts: 59
Joined: 09/12/2006
Posted: 08/22/2014 16:00:17
 
 
 I agree with others, no need to apologize, Actual Window Manager is awesome. Can't imagine my computer without it. I will never change OS just because of AWM. :)

-----
Actual Window Manager, ShellToys, Macro Express, AdMuncher,
gMote, DMEXBar, AutoHotkey...
 
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MGhell
Advanced user
 
 Posts: 141
Joined: 11/15/2008
Posted: 08/22/2014 19:15:56
 
 
 The product is awesome....a real swiss-army-knife-tool. And the support is second to none! Worth every penny, love it :-)

System:
DUAL WIN7 (32bit)/WIN10 PRO (64bit)
CPU Q9550S
4GB RAM
Nvidia 460GTX
 
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Pim Joosten
Resident
 
 Posts: 549
Joined: 11/11/2010
Posted: 08/22/2014 21:16:29
 
 
Quote
First of all, I'd like to deeply apologize for all that mess created by the delay of the beta 5 release.
I agree with all others Alex: no need to apologize. I just knew you were all working very hard, and this time you needed more time than what you anticipated. I know how that goes  ;) And it was no mess at all, just a minor issue. Like I said, I just went back to version 8.1.4. for a couple of days.

Quote
this "beta expiration issue" was 3rd or 4th in more than 9 years of development
That shows how good your development is :!:

Quote
each such case is a personal shame for me as a project head and an impact on the company's reputation in whole
You would have to do much, much worse things to do that  :D

Quote
BTW, those who complained about the inability to roll back seem to not read the Beta What's New section - just whom do we write it for?  ;)
For me perhaps? I read it every time when a new version is released. But I sometimes also forget the things I read  :oops:

Like I wrote before, I did not encounter the uninstall issue. Now I know why, I follow Rick's approach too: download manually and then install. I have switched off the auto-update function for all programs for which that is possible, to just get notifications. Therefore I did not have the update folder in ProgramData\Actual Tools. Like Rick and Gerard I then rename the downloads, a.o. including the version number.
BTW: talking about file names: what does aim in aimsetup stand for? Actual Tools Installation Module perhaps? I have been wondering for years.

Thank you too Alex, for following up, I appreciate it.

Quote
Here should be a "thumb up" smile
I requested the same very recently when complimenting Alexander Mihalkin for the awesome speed he adjusted the forums in response to a suggestion I made.

Best regards to all,

Pim
 
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Chris Miller
Advanced user
 
 Posts: 249
Joined: 08/02/2011
Posted: 08/22/2014 22:03:09
 
 
 Well, commendations to you all for your buttsniffery and nauseous chatter.  LOL

I for one appreciated and EXPECTED both the apology and the recognition that they need to do something different in future to not force a REGISTERED PAID user to have to roll back a version just because of a missed expiration date.  I've had bugs in the betas I've had to roll back versions for and worked with the developers to fix in the mean time.  Perfectly acceptable in that instance.

The bottom line is, this wasn't a software issues.  Heck, it wasn't even a beta issue (bug, error, etc).  This was a lack of judgement on their part that could have been easily avoided.  Would be no different than if they expired the NON-beta version because of a license period ending without a way to renew or continue using what you have.  DOH!!!  Sound familiar???  That was exactly the case during either the v5-to-v6 or v6-to-v7 changeover.  While the wait period was far less, it was still an impact to their users.

That said, as far as I'm concerned, I was able to post my suggestion for circumventing this in the future and it sounds like they'll look into handling things different.  I have no issue with a company having problems.  I by no means expect perfection, and I do expect things like this to happen and make accommodations for it.  That does NOT mean that just because it's a beta that these things should continue to happen when they CAN be resolved or changes made to avoid such inconveniences in future.

I've always been a HUGE supporter of this product and I go out of my way to show it to everybody I can.  I always make sure to tell them to get involved on forums because of how great the developers are.  Nothing I'm saying above is meant as a slam in any way.  I just want to make sure that before we all start singing Kumbaya and giving big group hugs that the reality of the situation is not lost in a bunch of over emotional rhetoric that goes nowhere to make both the product and the COMPANY better.

Thank you Developers, for all you do.  And more importantly, thank you for listening.  Remember that some of us that are the most critical of your product are sometimes the most supportive!  It goes a long way in showing just how important this product is to each and every one of us that use it.  I think we can all agree on that, if nothing else.
 
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Alex Fadeyev
Administrator

Moderator
 
 Posts: 1433
Joined: 09/30/2005
Posted: 08/22/2014 22:52:45
 
 
Quote
Well, commendations to you all for your buttsniffery and nauseous chatter. LOL

Chris, with all due respect - please watch your words. I will not allow you to insult our other users just because they don't agree with you. Please don't create a sad precedent of being the first user put into read-only on this forum.

I highly appreciate your contribution into our project and realize the profit of critical feedback but this does not grant you a right to talk smut in public. If you have any personal offense against me or our team - there is an option to send a personal message via forum or email. While talking to others, please keep calm and rational, communicate with respect, as mature people should do.

Thank you for understanding. And please accept my personal apologies for this "beta expiration" issue.
 
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Chris Miller
Advanced user
 
 Posts: 249
Joined: 08/02/2011
Posted: 08/22/2014 23:16:42
 
 
 Nor does it give anybody a right to call for apologies for my, or others, critical words of the beta expiration.

Gerard wrote "If anything us beta testers should apologise for some of the comments made over the past couple of days."


The point in my previous post was that everybody wants to jump on the "what can you do for me because I gave you praise no matter what" bandwagon.  Beta testing isn't always about the positives, nor should those that point out the negatives be made to feel less for it, regardless of whether the other individual has had those issues or not.

While I understand your point, and I'll try to word things better, it was as it was intended, to say that if I was to apologize for being too critical, I in turn call out those that give too much praise.
 
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Gerard Booth
Advanced user
 
 Posts: 119
Joined: 08/04/2008
Posted: 08/23/2014 01:56:02
 
 
Quote
Nor does it give anybody a right to call for apologies for my, or others, critical words of the beta expiration

OK Chris, it seems I have caused offence there, if I have offended you I do offer my sincere apology as it was not intended.

Quote
Beta testing isn't always about the positives, nor should those that point out the negatives be made to feel less for it, regardless of whether the other individual has had those issues or not.
I totally agree with you there, however some of the remarks were sarcastic and I guessed the ActualTools team felt it also.

Alex's post of 21/08 did explain the situation and the reason for the delay of a few days. I felt he had no need to offer his apologies, after all I chose to install and test the beta version, he had caused me no great hardship by the unforeseen delay of a couple of days and I had suffered no data loss or financial cost during this time. I simply chose to wait the few days for the new version, I could easily have reverted back to the stable release version if I chose to.


Quote
"what can you do for me because I gave you praise no matter what"
I'm not after anything, I do however like the product and have used it for a good many years and now and again its just nice for someone to give you a pat on the back in appreciation of your work.
 
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